Scandal fallout

[nonews 0]

how about letting the yakuzo orginizations sponsor them. those old dudes in charge of sumo would all have heart attacks and then they could be replaced by younger folks who understand the modern day life.

and get rid of the old jerks at NHK who think it's the end of the world what happened. I'm not paying the tv fee anymore. the only time I watch nhk is for the sumo anyway. they don't have anything else worth watching.

[Asashosakari 19,319]

how about letting the yakuzo orginizations sponsor them. those old dudes in charge of sumo would all have heart attacks and then they could be replaced by younger folks who understand the modern day life.

I've been reading your posts and for the life of me I can't figure out your point. "Yakuza contacts are part of the modern day life" or something like that? That would come as news to the rest of Japan, which has increasingly adopted the exact opposite attitude over the last ~20 years.

[Naganoyama 5,911]

...

Tokoyama (2): Kotosado, Kotoyodo

...

Presumably you mean Tokosado, Tokoyodo?

Edited July 5, 2010 by Naganoyama

[Asashosakari 19,319]

I give up. Yes. (In a state of confusion...) Clearly too many Koto's on the list!

[Harry 67]

...and get rid of the old jerks at NHK who think it's the end of the world what happened. I'm not paying the tv fee anymore. the only time I watch nhk is for the sumo anyway. they don't have anything else worth watching.

I cancelled mine in May after the second zensho yusho excitementfest was often interrupted more than usual by diet crap. The Japanese could sure learn a lot from the late night diet pill ads here in north america, they're much more interesting...

[Peterao 3]

...and get rid of the old jerks at NHK who think it's the end of the world what happened. I'm not paying the tv fee anymore. the only time I watch nhk is for the sumo anyway. they don't have anything else worth watching.

I cancelled mine in May after the second zensho yusho excitementfest was often interrupted more than usual by diet crap. The Japanese could sure learn a lot from the late night diet pill ads here in north america, they're much more interesting...

That or bring C-SPAN over here so that the Diet maniacs can have their fix on their own time.

[Jonosuke 28]

I understand those who do not live in Japan not to subscribe to TV Japan or tune in to their world service as they don't live in Japan and it really does not affect their life much regardless of if the sales tax goes up to 10% for instance. But for sumo fans, without NHK, we don't get Ozumo. Just think about it. All those sumo video you have been watching of Kitanoumi, Chiyonofuji, Takanohana, Akebono and Asashoryu do not exist without the NHK cameras. Before you complain, think which other TV network is willing to put in at least an hour of their afternoon in basho day to bring sumo live to you. None. If NHK stops their sumo broadcast, is there any channel bringing you the coverage? Nada.

I understand most of those sniping away do not understand Japanese fully to really appreciate some of their programming like NHK Special, drama or educational programs as they may rather want to watch other brain dead programming offered by commercial networks. Whether you like them or not, public broadcasters have certain obligations and that includes those Diet sessions those who have no roots in Japan dislike so much. Just like Ozumo, NHK is the only one who will cover it, instead of allowing you to watch latest gossips from the world of tarento on Wide shows. If they dislike Diet sessions so much, all they need to do is get BS and they can watch for four hours of live sumo, uninterrupted but I digress as those watching on NHK Sogo are not keen enough sumo watchers.

I believe NHK will cover the Nagoya as they have a responsibility to all those who look forward to watch it on TV every basho, most calling to NHK to stop broadcasting Ozumo live are not sumo fans and they don't watch it at all just like all those who complain about NHK are merely infrequent viewers of NHK.

Edited July 5, 2010 by Jonosuke

[jakking 0]

For those of us who follow sumo primarily through the NHK broadcasts carried by JapanTV overseas (such as those of us in Canada), the cancellation of NHK coverage would be a total disaster.

[Jonosuke 28]

For those of us who follow sumo primarily through the NHK broadcasts carried by JapanTV overseas (such as those of us in Canada), the cancellation of NHK coverage would be a total disaster.

Even if they cancel it (though I don't think they will), I understand you can at least get half hour daily Sumo Digest program as that is their contingency.

Of course even if you are watching by Keyhole, there will be no sumo if they don't carry it. I wonder if they at least decide to air it on BS.

[Peterao 3]

I'm sure that Samurai TV would jump at the chance to show sumo, if the price was right. Squeeze it in between some Michinoku Pro Wrestling and K1 fighting.

[nonews 0]

how about letting the yakuzo orginizations sponsor them. those old dudes in charge of sumo would all have heart attacks and then they could be replaced by younger folks who understand the modern day life.

I've been reading your posts and for the life of me I can't figure out your point. "Yakuza contacts are part of the modern day life" or something like that? That would come as news to the rest of Japan, which has increasingly adopted the exact opposite attitude over the last ~20 years.

my only point is why this minor betting has been blown out of proportion. betting on bseball doesn't have any effect on the outcome of sumo. the song and dance by nhk and the sumo association has gone from ridiculas to crazy. I think the actions taken are knee jerk reactions to something nhk and sumo has made into a big deal. I do live in Japan and used to pay the monthly tv fee. I have stopped paying and have taken my antenna down. I now use rabbitt ears. and they work fine. I even get AFN.

[Jonosuke 28]

What they are saying is that baseball gambling (and other illegal gambling) is a big revenue source for organized crime syndicates. Every respectable organization likes to disassociate themselves from such groups.

Not so long ago my cousin was walking down train station stairs when a guy bumped into him from behind. The guy asked him to apologize as my cousin should know he was a member. So my cousin apologized but he said he didn't like the attitude and he and his buddy beat him up. Now you sure don't want to have these people to walk around your neighborhood because they have nothing better to do as they make a good living not doing anything except bothering other law abiding folks.

Edited July 5, 2010 by Jonosuke

[James H 0]

betting on bseball doesn't have any effect on the outcome of sumo.

Huh? I am sure this has been touched on elsewhere, but isn't that a little naive? If there is illegal betting on baseball (which has shady links to the mob but nothing like sumo) then what makes you think there isn't illegal betting on sumo that hasn't been mentioned yet?

The elephant in the room of this whole scandal is that sumo wrestlers - top sumo wrestlers - were compromised by their behaviour outside of the ring. That would make them prime targets to be persuaded to compromise their behaviour inside the ring too...especially when it is so easy to fix the result of a sumo bout in advance.

[nonews 0]

maybe thats why kotomisuki blew the whistle on the blackmailing. the yakuza might have been after him to throw some bouts so they could win. burn the whistle blower. I thought japan had laws against whistleblowing revenge. like other countries have. there is betting on every sport there is. how much was won and lost on the world cup by politicos and probably sumo association bosses. the little guy knows he can't win so why try when it comes to complaints. I would like to see kotomisuki get a ghost writter and write a tell all.

someone needs to do it. may as well be someone who has been told to bend over we are behind you all the way. hold your breath.

the so called independant appointees to the board are as worthless as tits on a boar. they are meddling in things they don't understand or really have any knowledge of. don't make any sense do I?? I know what I mean I just can't get it out.

[Peterao 3]

my only point is why this minor betting has been blown out of proportion.

A while back, I noticed something funny about myself. It wasn't something that prevented me from going about my daily life, but it stood out enough that it warranted further investigation. It took several months, and all the while other people told me that I was making a mountain out of a molehill. But I finally found the cancer that would have killed me within 2 years. The only way to fix the problem was with immediate, aggressive chemotherapy. I'm OK now, but after that I will need to remain vigilant for the rest of my life.

Maybe a cigar is just a cigar, and this gambling is not a symptom of anything else. But you don't know that. There is only one way to know, and that way is not stubbornly carrying-on as if nothing is wrong.

[nonews 0]

there is something wrong but you don't fix it by beating up on someone who reported the problem. congratulations on joining the I beat cancer club. been a member for 5 years myself. but betting on baseball by kotomisuke isn't a cancer like some try and make it out to be. he isn't the problem. a lot of the problem is those at the top of sumo trying to keep the 1950's and 60's in sumo and not growing with the modern world.

[Asashosakari 19,319]

there is something wrong but you don't fix it by beating up on someone who reported the problem.

Kotomitsuki didn't report anything. He got blackmailed for 100 million yen following a previous successful extortion for 3.5 million yen, sought private advice from other Kyokai members he's on friendly terms with because it was more money than he was willing to pay (and perhaps not even capable), then the whole thing somehow got out to the tabloids. Kotomitsuki didn't even admit to betting on baseball, let alone to the extortion, when the Kyokai leadership and the police came calling at that point.

a lot of the problem is those at the top of sumo trying to keep the 1950's and 60's in sumo and not growing with the modern world.

You keep saying that, but I still have no idea what you mean exactly, especially considering your apparent solution for the current crisis would have been to be stubborn and do absolutely nothing, other than tell the ministry and the outraged public to shove it. Tacit approval of underworld contacts is exactly what keeping the 1950's and 60's in sumo would look like.

Edited July 5, 2010 by Asashosakari

[Peterao 3]

Congratulations to you as well.

I guess I agree as far as saying that Kotomitsuki should not be banned until all of the facts are known. All the more reason why no honbasho should take place until all the facts are known and everything can be dealt with appropriately.

That ship has sailed, but NHK can still show our disapproval by not covering this sham.

EDIT: I'm not sure why Asashosakari's response to this message was deleted, but with regards to the contention that waiting to resume until after a full investigation into sumo is complete would mean that sumo would resume "maybe in 2012, for the extreme minority of Japanese still interested", that pretty much describes the number of people interested in Noh plays and Go tournaments, yet those traditions continue to carry on with little scandal. Perhaps sumo tradition would be better served by a smaller, less visible fan base?

Edited July 6, 2010 by Peterao

[Peterao 3]

Riji replacement Mr. Murayama is meeting with NHK representatives today ahead of NHK's final decision. There is growing support amongst the oyakata for the idea of refunding the broadcast fees. (I believe that this is what NHK has been angling for all along...)

[Peterao 3]

Finally, a silver lining! Banzuke sheets are selling at 50 times their normal volume, apparently fueled by fans' belief that the last banzuke with Kotomitsuki's name on it is destined to become a collector's item.

Incidently, Kotomitsuki's name is nowhere to be found on the sumo.goo.ne.jp website banzuke. Have they ever removed a name that was on the official banzuke before?

[Doitsuyama 1,185]

Incidently, Kotomitsuki's name is nowhere to be found on the sumo.goo.ne.jp website banzuke. Have they ever removed a name that was on the official banzuke before?

Not totally correct... he was there when I grabbed the banzuke for Sumo Reference yesterday, just as it was online. I believe it was a dumb move not to white him out, like they did several times recently. I think I will let him stay on the Sumo Reference banzuke, since he is on the printed banzuke...

[Peterao 3]

Incidently, Kotomitsuki's name is nowhere to be found on the sumo.goo.ne.jp website banzuke. Have they ever removed a name that was on the official banzuke before?

Not totally correct... he was there when I grabbed the banzuke for Sumo Reference yesterday, just as it was online. I believe it was a dumb move not to white him out, like they did several times recently. I think I will let him stay on the Sumo Reference banzuke, since he is on the printed banzuke...

Let's play "Where's Kotomitsuki"!

http://sumo.goo.ne.jp/hon_basho/banzuke/ban_1_1.html

http://sumo.goo.ne.jp/eng/hon_basho/banzuke/ban_1_1.html

His page is still there, he's just not listed on the banzuke itself.

http://sumo.goo.ne.jp/eng/ozumo_meikan/rik...ikishi_114.html

[Randomitsuki 2,826]

betting on bseball doesn't have any effect on the outcome of sumo.

Huh? I am sure this has been touched on elsewhere, but isn't that a little naive? If there is illegal betting on baseball (which has shady links to the mob but nothing like sumo) then what makes you think there isn't illegal betting on sumo that hasn't been mentioned yet?

The elephant in the room of this whole scandal is that sumo wrestlers - top sumo wrestlers - were compromised by their behaviour outside of the ring. That would make them prime targets to be persuaded to compromise their behaviour inside the ring too...especially when it is so easy to fix the result of a sumo bout in advance.

I was wondering about the yakuzua-yaocho connection as well, since this topic was brought up at several places. However, until now no one in the know could confirm that (illegal) betting on sumo bouts exists. You say it would be "a little naive" not to think about such a connection, and you state that there might or might not be "illegal betting on sumo that hasn't been mentioned yet".

Now does it exist beyond doubt? Is it rumored to exist? I mean, if the yakuza is into it, there must have been a market big enough , so there should me more than just rumors.

[Kintamayama 45,111]

Now does it exist beyond doubt? Is it rumored to exist? I mean, if the yakuza is into it, there must have been a market big enough , so there should me more than just rumors.

Reminder-illegal gambling within sumo was just a rumor a few weeks ago as well.

[Randomitsuki 2,826]

Now does it exist beyond doubt? Is it rumored to exist? I mean, if the yakuza is into it, there must have been a market big enough , so there should me more than just rumors.

Reminder-illegal gambling within sumo was just a rumor a few weeks ago as well.

I was under the impression that many people in Japan knew that illegal baseball betting existed, and that there is a large baseball betting marekt run by yakuza. The only news was that sumotori were participating in those bets. Or did I get it all wrong, and rikishi were more or less the only people in Japan who gambled on baseball results? Edited July 6, 2010 by Randomitsuki