Natsu Basho 2013 discussion thread

[Yubinhaad 11,761]

Osunaarashi is congratulated by his heya's affiliated sewanin Yuho, after sealing the Makushita yusho on Day 13.

And with Juryo yusho winner Kotoyuki after receiving their prizes.

Myogiryu with his Gino-sho plaque and certificate.

Shohozan wins the invisible weightlifting competition.

Shikimori Toshihiro, circa 1971.

[Jakusotsu 6,049]

What a silly picture on the gino-sho plaque. Greek olympian holding a kabuto?

[yorikiried by fate 2,029]

Completely random stat: This was apparently the 100th makuuchi zensho yusho in history.

Yeah, that's a pretty cool milestone. Nikkan posted the list (to #99) here. And by this list, if Kisenosato had won he would have been the 100th different Makuuchi yusho winner.

If someone could translate the columns (and maybe the respective starting points of the two lists, I would be happy to provide English versions.

[Kuroyama 715]

What a silly picture on the gino-sho plaque. Greek olympian holding a kabuto?

It's no sillier than that goofy fanfare they use when unveiling the yusho portraits. At least it doesn't have parts pixellated out...

Edited May 27, 2013 by Kuroyama

[kuroimori 1,634]

Hakuho in the yusho interview expects a yokozuna run for Kise next basho - finishing with 2 two wins difference should have made that impossible.

Since Asahifuji's promotion they are pretty much locked into the 2 consecutive yusho position so even a good quality jun-yusho like this one may only count if Kisenosato were to win the next two basho.

Swami

The Kotoshogiku loss hurt him, that's for sure... I don't think they would have a problem to promote him on Jun-Yusho / Yusho performances (they could in particularily site that the two yusho rule tends to be more lenient the more Yokozuna there already are in active competition). The 13-2 score however is a world away from a 14-1, and even more importantly, I think they would hesitate very much to promote him with his first Yusho.

From a slightly different stat-twisting perspective, one could argue that losing to the Geek meant good luck so far for Kise when we talk promotions.

Remember, Kise lost all three bouts to Show-Geek during his ozeki-run including the last bout of this 3-basho period, a loss that at least I thought would shatter his dream of getting promoted, but he got promoted anyway.

So now he lost to him again in what was mostly perceived as a must-win match for his Yok-prom.

But hey! let's see how things unfold in Nagoya.

Maybe he can pull off a 14-1 (with another loss to Kotoshogiku...) (Whistling...)

[Millwood 41]

I must admit I've never been a Kise fan. That said -

There is a saying in business - if you want to be a manager, dress like a manager.

I'd suggest - if you want to be a Yokozuna, act like a Yokozuna.

Kise's tachiai nonsense is not acting like a Yokozuna. I interpret Hak's half henka as a response to the nonsense.

Yokozuna's should believe they can win every match on their skill and strength. Kise clearly doesn't.

[Benevolance 2,511]

I wish that Ikioi would work on his killer instinct. Both this tournament and last, he's managed to lose fights where he had the advantage of his opponent, but failed to finish him off. His 9-6 wasn't bad, except that he wasn't fighting anyone particularly outstanding, and he completely fluked out in his fight against Kaisei. From M10, I felt he should have been able to pick up double digits.

[Asojima 2,874]

I wish that Ikioi would work on his killer instinct. Both this tournament and last, he's managed to lose fights where he had the advantage of his opponent, but failed to finish him off. His 9-6 wasn't bad, except that he wasn't fighting anyone particularly outstanding, and he completely fluked out in his fight against Kaisei. From M10, I felt he should have been able to pick up double digits.

Asasekiryu had a similar problem when he first arrived in makuuchi. He would fight like hell until he had his aite at a definite disadvantage, and then he would relax and lose it. I called it technicianitis.

[Kuroyama 715]

Kise's tachiai nonsense is not acting like a Yokozuna. I interpret Hak's half henka as a response to the nonsense.

I'd agree, except that during the second half of the basho he seemed to jettison it. I say that without reviewing the video, but I definitely got the impression that as his record improved, his confidence improved, and he started behaving himself.

[torquato 1,075]

Osunaarashi's kesho mawashi will of course show a pyramid.

This preview on his FB site somehow confirms

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=575457255807646&set=a.316999988320042.73083.315982338421807&type=1&theater

:-D

[Akinomaki 40,783]

The YDC announced concerning Harumafuji that after 9-6 last basho and 11-4 this time, if he gets another such poor result in Nagoya they may issue a "gekirei" (encouragement), the most lenient of the warnings by the YDC - next is "caution" and than the retirement recommendation.
YDC chief Uchiyama about the yokozuna with the sore ankles: I feel for him, but Nagoya is the critical moment.

[Doitsuyama 1,192]

Isn't this announcement of the possible gekirei the most lenient of warnings? Or can it be more lenient? (Laughing...)

[krindel 675]

The YDC announced concerning Harumafuji that after 9-6 last basho and 11-4 this time, if he gets another such poor result in Nagoya they may issue a "gekirei" (encouragement), the most lenient of the warnings by the YDC - next is "caution" and than the retirement recommendation.

YDC chief Uchiyama about the yokozuna with the sore ankles: I feel for him, but Nagoya is the critical moment.

Wow... A comment from the YDC that actually sounds diplomatic and well thought of... What is this world coming to?

Seriously however, I think its a very careful comment on their part. They can't, of course, say "He's doing excellent, keep up the good work", but they also avoided Tsuruta-ish overreactions of the "He needs to produce a yusho and at least three tsuriotoshi victories in a row to demonstrate his power and prove we were not wrong in promoting him" variety...

And, if they are even thinking of a Kisenosato promotion for July, they are doing well to be careful, since overly aggressive comments could come back to haunt them...

[Akinomaki 40,783]

Hochi has more details: less than 13 wins may lead to the gekirei - Uchiyama also hints that Harumafuji may face the situation where he himself has to decide (to retire or not).

Member Okamoto: If 9 to 11 wins continue, as soon as for Kyushu the talk of retirement will come up. For a yokozuna 3 losses is the limit. Depending on the result, even in Nagoya the (retirement-)talk will come up.

[yorikiried by fate 2,029]

This is so ridiculous. Harumafuji should take a year off (just like his famous [Japanese] predecessors), collect the Yokozuna salary, then come back for a basho (15-0 anyone?), and repeat until he's 40. What a bunch of morons.

[Akinomaki 40,783]

Hakuho morning after interview: it has been worth fighting an all-win Kisenosato to get the yusho.

Edited May 28, 2013 by Akinomaki

[ScreechingOwl 343]

Well, this is a bit troublesome. Obviously the 9-6s can't continue. But if Harumafuji is going to be criticized for 11-4s, he isn't going to make it to the end of the year. Since when is anything under 13 wins considered mandatory for a yokozuna? I really think we are all spoiled by the Asashoryu/Hakuho era of unusual dominance and consistent excellence. To wit:

Kitanofuji -- four consecutive 11-4 records before picking up his 6th yusho. Two consecutive 10-5 before picking up his 10th yusho. Was he criticized publicly?

Wajima -- 10-5, 11th yusho, 10-5, 1-1-13, 9-6, 12th yusho.

Wakanohana -- 8 consecutive basho (two of them no appearances) with no more than 11 victories.

Takanosato -- two 11-4 followed by two 10-5.

Hokutoumi -- three consecutive 11-4 records, followed by his 6th yusho, followed by two consecutive 10-5 records.

Chiyonofuji -- twice had back to back 11-4, twice had consecutive 10-5 records (one of those times separated by a no appearance).

Were any of these yokozuna criticized during these streaks? I bet not.

And I'm not cherry picking -- none of the above-mentioned were at the tail end of the respective yokozuna's career. The council should think long and hard before criticizing 11-4s; otherwise future Japanese yokozuna are going to be in for a great deal of criticism.

[krindel 675]

The YDC has one role, every two months... To say their opinion about the Yokozuna and by long extension, the Ozeki... The reason for their always having to say stuff is that, well, if they don't talk, they don't exist. (and noone usually cares much when they DO talk).

I still stand by my previous statement that by their standards, the current statements are mild and relatively well thought of. I am pretty sure the comments are the result of direct questions by the press, so I can't really imagine the YDC chairman on being asked "What do you think of Harumafuji's performance?" could possibly answer "I am really pleased and he should continue".

Gist of it is "He could be doing better, we hope he does better next time, so lets see how it goes". Compare with Tsuruta's comment "As a yokozuna, you at least have to be able to get double digits wins, or you don't qualify. His poor performance leaves us with the feeling that we might have promoted him too quickly." from only six months ago and you'll see the difference.

[Masumasumasu 902]

The zoo is missing one of its monkeys (0:50):

[Bugman 384]

For what it's worth, (not much) in my opinion i think that 11-4 is ok for a Yokozuna, 12 should be beyond criticism, 11 not great but certainly should not elicit talk of hara-kiri with a spoon, anything under ten is fair comment for criticism.

Edited May 28, 2013 by Bugman

[Masumasumasu 902]

The YDC announced concerning Harumafuji that after 9-6 last basho and 11-4 this time, if he gets another such poor result in Nagoya they may issue a "gekirei" (encouragement), the most lenient of the warnings by the YDC - next is "caution" and than the retirement recommendation.

YDC chief Uchiyama about the yokozuna with the sore ankles: I feel for him, but Nagoya is the critical moment.

Can't he tell them to go f-ck themselves?

[Masumasumasu 902]

The zoo is missing one of its monkeys (0:50):

To the 'man' shouting at Kotoushu I say, "יימח שמו וזכרו". Edited May 28, 2013 by Masumasumasu

[yorikiried by fate 2,029]

I mean, Hokuho might be controversial in some respects, but calling himself "sod"?

[Kintamayama 45,527]

The zoo is missing one of its monkeys (0:50):

To the 'man' shouting at Kotoushu I say, "ימח שמו וזכרו".

It's יימח שמו וזכרו.

[Masumasumasu 902]

The zoo is missing one of its monkeys (0:50):

To the 'man' shouting at Kotoushu I say, "ימח שמו וזכרו".

It's יימח שמו וזכרו.

Thanks. I'm not one of the Chosen.