Nagoya Basho 2013 discussion thread

[Naganoyama 5,881]

Kotooshu just hates it when anyone else looks like passing him. Still if it makes him do the sumo we once

expected of him...

[shumitto 418]

Dang, I had just about given up on Kotooshu ever surprising me but that winning move was a thing of beauty. Dare I get my hopes up for a better than average showing for him this basho?

Kotooshu is like an artist in a very loose sense. He knows his trade well, but woes or whatever keep him down every now and then.

[yorikiried by fate 2,001]

Kotooshu will take the yusho. Next stop Yokozuna after Aki.

You heard it here first and last and always.

[Asashosakari 18,996]

You misspelled Kotoshogiku.

[yorikiried by fate 2,001]

You misspelled Kotoshogiku.

Which reminds me: I will have to quickly paint a small piece of wall, so that later I have something more interesting to watch during his bout.

[Masumasumasu 902]

Kotooshu will take the yusho. Next stop Yokozuna after Aki.

You heard it here first and last and always.

That's pretty funny!

[yorikiried by fate 2,001]

600th Makuuchi win for Wakanosato. (That equals 40 zensho tournaments.)

[Akinomaki 40,068]

I somewhat expected Tokitenku to wake up after yesterday. Completely changed.

[ALAKTORN 346]

Kotoōshū got robbed.

[Akinomaki 40,068]

I think a tori-naoshi was a good decision, Takayasu deserved it for his effort. What sansho will it be for him ?

[aderechelsea 124]

Oshu just embarrassed himself once again. I doubt that he needed that henka in the tori-naoshi ... and he lost easily after that.

just for the record ... i thought he clearly won the first bout but what do i know? (i cannot complain though since i predicted a Takayasu win in the 2 daily games i am currently active)

[Akinomaki 40,068]

And Goeido continues to head for mid maegashira.

[ALAKTORN 346]

I think a tori-naoshi was a good decision, Takayasu deserved it for his effort. What sansho will it be for him ?

…Does effort really matter? Even if someone gets a bad win, a win is still a win. It doesn’t make sense to me to say that it was a tie just because the aite put in more effort.

Edit: yeah, Gōeidō completely disappointing.

Edit2: Aminishiki pulls off the first successful henka. Despicable.

Edited July 12, 2013 by ALAKTORN

[Asashosakari 18,996]

And Goeido continues to head for mid maegashira.

A couple of days ago I happened to run into this while looking for something else:

Kitanoumi rijicho [...] about Goueidou who is looking good: "He had double-digit wins last basho and it looks to me like he is aiming for the next level.."

Incidentally, far be it from me to disrupt the rising chorus of "Chiyotairyu will be the next yokozuna" voices, but IMHO he'll run into exactly the same consistency issues that keep plagueing Goeido - just way too many moving parts to his sumo and it's a basho-by-basho gamble whether they'll actually work together in the intended way.

Edited July 12, 2013 by Asashosakari

[Igordemorais 75]

I see what you mean. Consistency and a solid demeanor in the ring are the basis of a Yokozuna. Just look at Harumafuji, that's the level of technical genius you have to have in order to be a Yokozuna without consistency. Goeido and Chiyotairyu are not even remotely close to that yet.

[Kintamayama 44,652]

I have much to say but insufficient time.

A. Osh was robbed. It's not the first time-the other times were even more blatant. It's always him -someone will no doubt remember the details.

B. If Chiyotairyuu remains healthy (and that's a big if-these Kokonoe lads are very injury-prone, all of them..) he will make Yokozuna.

C. Oosunaarashi, barring backaches and extreme hunger- Ozeki for sure.

D. Musashikuni. A very slow ascent. I don't think he will make sekitori. I know it's early days etc.. but he just doesn't seem to have that killer instinct.

E. Kuniyama - not born yet, but dai-Yokozuna.

[Akinomaki 40,068]

I think a tori-naoshi was a good decision, Takayasu deserved it for his effort. What sansho will it be for him ?

…Does effort really matter? Even if someone gets a bad win, a win is still a win. It doesn’t make sense to me to say that it was a tie just because the aite put in more effort.

With effort I mean he was the one going forward and he was the challenger against a top-ranker, that often gets the one a better treatment (I guess not against Kisenosato though). I first got accustomed to that, now I'm even in favor.

[Jakusotsu 5,876]

The level of the opponents this basho is, in his own words, "harder than I ever expected".

Will be a nice litmus test against Homasho tomorrow.

[Mark.Buckton 68]

C. Oosunaarashi, barring backaches and extreme hunger- Ozeki for sure.

Backaches? There are no backaches.

only last Friday he was in hospital in Nagoya for his back - something he revealed to a reporter when he returned to the heya.

[aderechelsea 124]

Homasho as a defensive rikishi (at least that's how i see him) will indeed be a good test. Osuna is a prime candidate for a hikiotoshi loss against a rikishi with patience. Maybe Asasekiryu will be a good test too even though he lacks the power he used to portray back in his good days.

Homasho vs Osuna will be one of the top 3 bouts in Juryo tomorrow. Definitely the most interesting one.

Homarefuji - Kyokushuho (as a fan) and Wakakoyu - Satoyama (i find Satoyama reborn this basho) are the other ones that i am also expecting to watch.

[Kintamayama 44,652]

C. Oosunaarashi, barring backaches and extreme hunger- Ozeki for sure.

Backaches? There are no backaches. No injury problem since the slight underarm tear last basho which healed up right after the tournament.

Just called him now to confirm and yep, nothing. Slight bit of a fever before the basho but otherwise in perfect condition.

The heat and fighting every day though he told me is extremely difficult. The level of the opponents this basho is, in his own words, "harder than I ever expected".

Ok, excellent!! I thought I had read something about backaches.

[Asashosakari 18,996]

I see what you mean. Consistency and a solid demeanor in the ring are the basis of a Yokozuna.

Even ozeki, in my opinion. Take Dejima and Chiyotaikai as ozeki with a somewhat similar approach - in their heyday they were in total control of their (tsuki-)oshi, and that kind of consistency is what's needed to win 10+ every time. (Unless you're a massive bundle of talent like Hakuho or Asashoryu.) By contrast Chiyotairyu is totally chaotic as of right now. It's working very well this basho, but even in his short makuuchi career we've already seen it multiple times that his timing completely deserted him for several days in a row.

Just look at Kotoshogiku who used to have similar consistency issues - even though his preferred gabburi-yori approach is conceptually much easier than tsuki-oshi and less prone to technical screw-ups, he still needed several years against top competition to work out most of the kinks and eventually reach ozeki quality. Maybe I'll turn out to be completely wrong, but I just don't buy Chiyotairyu as an ozeki contender right now, let alone more than that. He just doesn't have the innate talent to be able to get to ozeki as an unfinished product.

Edited July 12, 2013 by Asashosakari

[Akinomaki 40,068]

Day 5: 4100 spectators
Takayasu's hand touched down first, but Kotooshu was already flying (no talk of shini-tai, but I'd say his hand touched the extended dohyo plane). Takayasu, when the tori-naoshi was declared: “Yesss!” (yoshi), later “I wasn't confident (about the outcome of the first bout). Feels like making an extra profit.”
Gloomy Kotooshu, looking sure to have won the first bout, again and again complaining to reporters: “To me it looked like the other fell down first, oh yes. How was it ?”

[Asashosakari 18,996]

D. Musashikuni. A very slow ascent. I don't think he will make sekitori. I know it's early days etc.. but he just doesn't seem to have that killer instinct.

After his maezumo bouts I'm actually wondering just what he was doing for that more than half a year he was unofficially practicing at Fujishima-beya. The Koike bout was mostly a brawl and he did well in that, but with all the "normal" sumo stuff that was thrown at him in the last four bouts, he seemed completely clueless how to respond. Really odd - heck, even the jonokuchi no-hopers like Okino at least know how to get into a yotsu stance, even if they don't have a clue how to make a successful offensive move. Musashikuni seemed to lack even that most basic level of sumo understanding, and that's rather strange after a year of practice under what's presumably pretty good coaching.

(By contrast, his stablemate Morimune has come a long way in the basics, compared to his utterly depressing maezumo appearances six months ago.)

Edited July 12, 2013 by Asashosakari

[Asashosakari 18,996]

The level of the opponents this basho is, in his own words, "harder than I ever expected".

Will be a nice litmus test against Homasho tomorrow.

Sure, but today's opponent was also komusubi last year and that went well.

Wakakoyu's a lot further removed from komusubi quality now than Homasho, though.

Then again, Homasho looks like the injury has taken a lot out of him, too. Even accounting for the fact that his defensive fighting style will never really look dominant, he seems to be having a surprisingly hard time shining against upper-juryo opposition, even if the record is good.