Hatsu 2016 Rikishi Status - Day 15 MIA

[Akinomaki 40,755]

The return of Chiyootori for day 6 was announced in the early news.

http://www.sanspo.com/sports/news/20160114/sum16011412290006-n1.html

Jokoryu injured his right leg in the bout against Chiyotairyu and needed the wheelchair all the way out.

http://www.daily.co.jp/newsflash/sumo/2016/01/14/0008722097.shtml

Terunofuji apparently injured his right shoulder in the (too long for his already bad condition) bout against Kyokushuho. He already had to put ice on it after the day 4 Aoiyama bout and might have aggravated it. The oyakata avoided a clear statement and just told the press that he'll talk it out with Terunofuji and will tell about it tomorrow (hopefully nothing). Terunofuji didn't go to a hospital and returned to the heya without giving statements - he never had a day of kyujo yet in his whole career.

http://www.sanspo.com/sports/news/20160114/sum16011422330013-n1.html

Edited January 14, 2016 by Akinomaki

[Katooshu 3,325]

Terunofuji apparently injured his right shoulder in the (too long for his already bad condition) bout against Kyokushuho. He already had to put ice on it after the day 4 Aoiyama bout and might have aggravated it. The oyakata avoided a clear statement and just told the press that he'll talk it out with Terunofuji and will tell about it tomorrow (hopefully nothing). Terunofuji didn't go to a hospital and returned to the heya without giving statements - he never had a day of kyujo yet in his whole career.

http://www.sanspo.com/sports/news/20160114/sum16011422330013-n1.html

That may not be a good thing. I think his body needs more time to recover.

[WAKATAKE 2,671]

Terunofuji apparently injured his right shoulder in the (too long for his already bad condition) bout against Kyokushuho. He already had to put ice on it after the day 4 Aoiyama bout and might have aggravated it. The oyakata avoided a clear statement and just told the press that he'll talk it out with Terunofuji and will tell about it tomorrow (hopefully nothing). Terunofuji didn't go to a hospital and returned to the heya without giving statements - he never had a day of kyujo yet in his whole career.

http://www.sanspo.com/sports/news/20160114/sum16011422330013-n1.html

Teru stuck it out way too longer than he should have. In fact, he should have been sitting out last basho after trying to win the yusho in September. Now he's worse because he decided he wanted to stick it out. Personally it's disappointing that it has come to this. His oyakata should have been more firm in telling Teru that he needed to heal.

Aminishiki also seems to have withdrawn from the tournament as well.

http://www.nikkansports.com/battle/sumo/news/1592335.html

[inhashi 2,363]

Reports online that Terunofuji, Aminishiki, and Jokoryu are out for day 6.

http://www.nikkansports.com/battle/sumo/news/1592335.html

[Fukurou 534]

Day 6 Late

A trio of late sekitori withdrawals, according to the NSK website:

West Ozeki TERUNOFUJI (3-2) (link) (link)

East Maegashira 1 AMINISHIKI (2-3) (link)

East Maegashira 14 JOKORYU (2-3) (link)

Edited January 16, 2016 by Fukurou

[Kintamayama 45,495]

Terunofuji (right collarbone fracture suffered during the day 4 bout against Aoiyama, his first kyujo ever).

Joukouryuu (right foot) - pretty obvious from watching yesterday's bout.

Aminishiki (the flu, 3 days out, will probably return after two days max..).

Isegahama - "Terunofuji has a fractured collar bone so he won't be returning this basho and will possibly be hospitalized. I have no idea how long he will take to heal. Aminishiki will probably overcome his flu and return.."

Edited January 15, 2016 by Kintamayama

[Jakusotsu 6,045]

That collar bone might actually be a blessing for his knees.

[Koukai 4]

Is Wakakeisho going to retire?

[WAKATAKE 2,671]

I can see Aminishiki coming back, hopefully he can try to rack up some wins against some lower opponents unless he's made cannon fodder.

[Fukurou 534]

Day 7

Returning:

West Sandanme 79 KIRYU (0-1-2, absent from 2)

Withdrawing:

East Jonidan 12 TSURUGIKAZE (1-2)

East Jonidan 23 ONOKURA (2-1)

[hamcornheinz 839]

Aminishiki might as well take these few days off, he probably wasn't gonna win these few days anyway.

[Akinomaki 40,755]

Aminishiki said he mustn't spread the virus and expects to reenter later.

http://www.nikkansports.com/battle/sumo/news/1592500.html

[Asashosakari 19,647]

Aminishiki might as well take these few days off, he probably wasn't gonna win these few days anyway.

How so? He's already done with all yokozuna and ozeki, so it's not like he has any really hard matches left...

Joukouryuu (right foot) - pretty obvious from watching yesterday's bout.

Right knee MCL, to be exact. Edited January 15, 2016 by Asashosakari

[hamcornheinz 839]

Aminishiki might as well take these few days off, he probably wasn't gonna win these few days anyway.

How so? He's already done with all yokozuna and ozeki, so it's not like he has any really hard matches left...

Not a bad point. But he does have the sanyaku and that is four people who are likely to beat him. Of course with Aminishiki you can't really tell.

[Akinomaki 40,755]

As I mentioned before in other threads, the countdown to kyujo is on for Endo since the start of the basho.
The oyakata last night had encouraged him to go kyujo, but he wanted to do one more.
The main injury this time is the ankle. Since before the basho just going down the stairs is painful for him.
The left knee he had injured last Haru against Shohozan hadn't healed and at the Aki bashi in addition he injured the right ankle. He aggravated this injury at the Kyushu basho and on the 7th this month he sprained the ankle again during keiko.
Kyujo would mean a drop to juryo (but he isn't fit enough to get the necessary 5 wins to remain in makuuchi anyway).
There's a saying that when you drop on the banzuke, you are only able to do the sumo of that rank. The shisho had told him that to get back to makuuchi it takes 2 or 3 times the effort you needed for first rising up to the division.
So far he had avoided taping, but this basho he uses it. Asked about the injury he said "I don't know."
http://www.sponichi.co.jp/sports/news/2016/01/08/kiji/K20160108011819820.html
http://www.asahi.com/articles/ASJ1H3JCSJ1HUTQP00B.html

[Akinomaki 40,755]

Asakayama-shimpan (Kaio) is kyujo since day 6 with about 40°C fever, likely for about 2 or 3 days (same as Isegahama-beya's Aminishiki maybe).

Same Isegahama-ichimon Takashima-shimpan (Koboyama) filled in for him today.

http://www.nikkansports.com/battle/sumo/news/1592705.html

[ScreechingOwl 343]

As I mentioned before in other threads, the countdown to kyujo is on for Endo since the start of the basho.

The oyakata last night had encouraged him to go kyujo, but he wanted to do one more.

The main injury this time is the ankle. Since before the basho just going down the stairs is painful for him.

The left knee he had injured last Haru against Shohozan hadn't healed and at the Aki bashi in addition he injured the right ankle. He aggravated this injury at the Kyushu basho and on the 7th this month he sprained the ankle again during keiko.

Kyujo would mean a drop to juryo (but he isn't fit enough to get the necessary 5 wins to remain in makuuchi anyway).

There's a saying that when you drop on the banzuke, you are only able to do the sumo of that rank. The shisho had told him that to get back to makuuchi it takes 2 or 3 times the effort you needed for first rising up to the division.

So far he had avoided taping, but this basho he uses it. Asked about the injury he said "I don't know."

http://www.sponichi.co.jp/sports/news/2016/01/08/kiji/K20160108011819820.html

http://www.asahi.com/articles/ASJ1H3JCSJ1HUTQP00B.html

I'm glad to read that Endo will soon go kyujo. When significantly injured rikishi wrestle they tend to aggravate their injuries, or, like Terenofuji, develop new ones. (A few basho back Terunofuji injured one knee; now he has two injured knees and a fractured collarbone.) Plus, all Endo is doing is giving away victories. (I don't mean in the sense that he's not trying to win, just that he isn't physically capable of winning. ) The shisho's comment, on the other hand, is complete nonsense. Tochinoshin rose up through the ranks very easily once his knee heeled again: he registered four consecutive yusho, two in makushita and two in juryo, and he's continued to do well in the top division. The notion it was two or three times as hard for him to rise through the ranks again is risible.

It's clear that sumo needs to reinstate some form of the rule allowing injured rikishi one basho where they can be absent without a penalty in rank. Of course there can be some safeguards put in place to lessen the chance of abuse: perhaps allowing it to be used only once a year (or even once every other year); and perhaps either makuuchi or juryo should be expanded by two rikishi to compensate for extra absences. (Both divisions have contained more rikishi previously.)

I like to see my favourite rikishi compete. And I respect wrestling through minor injuries. But seeing rikishi hurt themselves further and struggle and still produce inferior sumo does neither the rikishi themselves nor the sport a favour. If sumo isn't ready yet to join the 21st century world perhaps it can at least recapture some of the better parts of the 20th.

[WAKATAKE 2,671]

As I mentioned before in other threads, the countdown to kyujo is on for Endo since the start of the basho.

The oyakata last night had encouraged him to go kyujo, but he wanted to do one more.

The main injury this time is the ankle. Since before the basho just going down the stairs is painful for him.

The left knee he had injured last Haru against Shohozan hadn't healed and at the Aki bashi in addition he injured the right ankle. He aggravated this injury at the Kyushu basho and on the 7th this month he sprained the ankle again during keiko.

Kyujo would mean a drop to juryo (but he isn't fit enough to get the necessary 5 wins to remain in makuuchi anyway).

There's a saying that when you drop on the banzuke, you are only able to do the sumo of that rank. The shisho had told him that to get back to makuuchi it takes 2 or 3 times the effort you needed for first rising up to the division.

So far he had avoided taping, but this basho he uses it. Asked about the injury he said "I don't know."

http://www.sponichi.co.jp/sports/news/2016/01/08/kiji/K20160108011819820.html

http://www.asahi.com/articles/ASJ1H3JCSJ1HUTQP00B.html

I'm glad to read that Endo will soon go kyujo. When significantly injured rikishi wrestle they tend to aggravate their injuries, or, like Terenofuji, develop new ones. (A few basho back Terunofuji injured one knee; now he has two injured knees and a fractured collarbone.) Plus, all Endo is doing is giving away victories. (I don't mean in the sense that he's not trying to win, just that he isn't physically capable of winning. ) The shisho's comment, on the other hand, is complete nonsense. Tochinoshin rose up through the ranks very easily once his knee heeled again: he registered four consecutive yusho, two in makushita and two in juryo, and he's continued to do well in the top division. The notion it was two or three times as hard for him to rise through the ranks again is risible.

It's clear that sumo needs to reinstate some form of the rule allowing injured rikishi one basho where they can be absent without a penalty in rank. Of course there can be some safeguards put in place to lessen the chance of abuse: perhaps allowing it to be used only once a year (or even once every other year); and perhaps either makuuchi or juryo should be expanded by two rikishi to compensate for extra absences. (Both divisions have contained more rikishi previously.)

I like to see my favourite rikishi compete. And I respect wrestling through minor injuries. But seeing rikishi hurt themselves further and struggle and still produce inferior sumo does neither the rikishi themselves nor the sport a favour. If sumo isn't ready yet to join the 21st century world perhaps it can at least recapture some of the better parts of the 20th.

They had that policy in place but apparently too many rikishi were abusing the system or were not as injured as they said they were. But the policy if I remember correctly wasn't in place during the 50s-70s, so if rikishi were managing to get by without back then, why not now. It's unfortunate when injuries occur, but then there are these rikishi who think they can get by if they take a few weeks off instead of taking the recommended two months like the doctor tells them. Prime examples of trying to gambarize are obviously Terunofuji and Endo. But look at Tochinoshin, he took his time off, took a hit on the banzuke, and yet half a year off provided the time he needed to heal. Plus he now owns the record for lowest rank return to sanyaku (Makushita 55).

[Fukurou 534]

They had that policy in place but apparently too many rikishi were abusing the system or were not as injured as they said they were. But the policy if I remember correctly wasn't in place during the 50s-70s, so if rikishi were managing to get by without back then, why not now. It's unfortunate when injuries occur, but then there are these rikishi who think they can get by if they take a few weeks off instead of taking the recommended two months like the doctor tells them. Prime examples of trying to gambarize are obviously Terunofuji and Endo. But look at Tochinoshin, he took his time off, took a hit on the banzuke, and yet half a year off provided the time he needed to heal. Plus he now owns the record for lowest rank return to sanyaku (Makushita 55).

Taking the time off to get your injuries addressed properly doesn't always work though. Takanohana missed 7 tournaments when he went to France for his knee surgery back in the early 2000s. He didn't lose rank when he finally came back (Yokozuna, you know), but they did tell him he had to compete or retire. He competed and did well - for 1 basho. Then he hurt his knee again, missing another tournament, came back, got hurt again and retired.

Still, I wish the system would allow the rikishi to get proper attention. Those injury pronouncements that get made are ridiculous (torn ACL - 1 week rest.... hah!)

[WAKATAKE 2,671]

They had that policy in place but apparently too many rikishi were abusing the system or were not as injured as they said they were. But the policy if I remember correctly wasn't in place during the 50s-70s, so if rikishi were managing to get by without back then, why not now. It's unfortunate when injuries occur, but then there are these rikishi who think they can get by if they take a few weeks off instead of taking the recommended two months like the doctor tells them. Prime examples of trying to gambarize are obviously Terunofuji and Endo. But look at Tochinoshin, he took his time off, took a hit on the banzuke, and yet half a year off provided the time he needed to heal. Plus he now owns the record for lowest rank return to sanyaku (Makushita 55).

Taking the time off to get your injuries addressed properly doesn't always work though. Takanohana missed 7 tournaments when he went to France for his knee surgery back in the early 2000s. He didn't lose rank when he finally came back (Yokozuna, you know), but they did tell him he had to compete or retire. He competed and did well - for 1 basho. Then he hurt his knee again, missing another tournament, came back, got hurt again and retired.

Still, I wish the system would allow the rikishi to get proper attention. Those injury pronouncements that get made are ridiculous (torn ACL - 1 week rest.... hah!)

I remember that basho quite well. Takanohana did exactly what Terunofuji did. He decided to compete because he didn't want to let the fans down and the yusho was within reach. So he competed instead of withdrawing. He won the yusho, which made everybody happy, including PM Koizumi. It was one of those inspirational type stories. But was it worth it in the end? Yes he took the time off, he did have the surgery. But the thing was that he competed when he shouldn't have. He would have had a more prolonged career if he had just withdrawn. My personal theory, you just hate to see people get hurt, and then go out with said injury and compete. Tochinoshin didn't do that. He got hurt, withdrew, didn't compete.

That's why when I see young guys like Endo and Terunofuji get injured, compete on said injuries, don't take the proper amount of time off to heal, compete again, re-aggravate their injuries and do poorly, you think I'm going to be happy? Takanohana provides the best example of one who sacrificed it all just to get that one yusho. I know it's prestigious, but sometimes it just ain't worth it.

[Asojima 2,874]

Endo is not listed as kyujo on the NSK site, but he is not included in the published torikumi for Day 8.

Aminishiki is returning on Day 8.

Edit: NSK site updated to show Endo as kyujo.

Edited January 16, 2016 by Asojima

[Gurowake 4,100]

Regardless of what may have been true when Asojima posted, Endo is listed as having withdrawn now.

[Gurowake 4,100]

They had that policy in place but apparently too many rikishi were abusing the system or were not as injured as they said they were. But the policy if I remember correctly wasn't in place during the 50s-70s, so if rikishi were managing to get by without back then, why not now. It's unfortunate when injuries occur, but then there are these rikishi who think they can get by if they take a few weeks off instead of taking the recommended two months like the doctor tells them. Prime examples of trying to gambarize are obviously Terunofuji and Endo. But look at Tochinoshin, he took his time off, took a hit on the banzuke, and yet half a year off provided the time he needed to heal. Plus he now owns the record for lowest rank return to sanyaku (Makushita 55).

Taking the time off to get your injuries addressed properly doesn't always work though. Takanohana missed 7 tournaments when he went to France for his knee surgery back in the early 2000s. He didn't lose rank when he finally came back (Yokozuna, you know), but they did tell him he had to compete or retire. He competed and did well - for 1 basho. Then he hurt his knee again, missing another tournament, came back, got hurt again and retired.

Still, I wish the system would allow the rikishi to get proper attention. Those injury pronouncements that get made are ridiculous (torn ACL - 1 week rest.... hah!)

I remember that basho quite well. Takanohana did exactly what Terunofuji did. He decided to compete because he didn't want to let the fans down and the yusho was within reach. So he competed instead of withdrawing. He won the yusho,

Takanohana did not win a yusho after any basho he was kyujo, as can be easily checked. He did get 12 wins after a year off though, which was impressive. If you're talking about some other time he was injured and didn't take any time off, well, I wouldn't have any idea how to determine that information.

Edited January 16, 2016 by Gurowake

[Gurowake 4,100]

There's a saying that when you drop on the banzuke, you are only able to do the sumo of that rank. The shisho had told him that to get back to makuuchi it takes 2 or 3 times the effort you needed for first rising up to the division.

The shisho's comment, on the other hand, is complete nonsense. Tochinoshin rose up through the ranks very easily once his knee heeled again: he registered four consecutive yusho, two in makushita and two in juryo, and he's continued to do well in the top division. The notion it was two or three times as hard for him to rise through the ranks again is risible.

Well, as much as I think the statement as presented is complete rubbish, I think there's a way in which it's true which he's probably not referring to, but I'll mention it anyway. In general, sekitori are not good enough to undo a 0-0-15 in one basho. Tochinoshin may have been able to, but I don't think Endo's nearly the same caliber. Also, Endo made Makuuchi in one Juryo basho, so he might have been saying (although I'm skeptical given the "There's a saying" wording) that it will probably take Endo 2 or 3 basho in Juryo to return, which is also true. If he truly takes his time to heal, he won't be back where he used to be for over a year, while he made Makuuchi in 3 basho from his start.

[WAKATAKE 2,671]

They had that policy in place but apparently too many rikishi were abusing the system or were not as injured as they said they were. But the policy if I remember correctly wasn't in place during the 50s-70s, so if rikishi were managing to get by without back then, why not now. It's unfortunate when injuries occur, but then there are these rikishi who think they can get by if they take a few weeks off instead of taking the recommended two months like the doctor tells them. Prime examples of trying to gambarize are obviously Terunofuji and Endo. But look at Tochinoshin, he took his time off, took a hit on the banzuke, and yet half a year off provided the time he needed to heal. Plus he now owns the record for lowest rank return to sanyaku (Makushita 55).

Taking the time off to get your injuries addressed properly doesn't always work though. Takanohana missed 7 tournaments when he went to France for his knee surgery back in the early 2000s. He didn't lose rank when he finally came back (Yokozuna, you know), but they did tell him he had to compete or retire. He competed and did well - for 1 basho. Then he hurt his knee again, missing another tournament, came back, got hurt again and retired.

Still, I wish the system would allow the rikishi to get proper attention. Those injury pronouncements that get made are ridiculous (torn ACL - 1 week rest.... hah!)

I remember that basho quite well. Takanohana did exactly what Terunofuji did. He decided to compete because he didn't want to let the fans down and the yusho was within reach. So he competed instead of withdrawing. He won the yusho,

Takanohana did not win a yusho after any basho he was kyujo, as can be easily checked. He did get 12 wins after a year off though, which was impressive. If you're talking about some other time he was injured and didn't take any time off, well, I wouldn't have any idea how to determine that information.

Takanohana suffered an injury on day 14 of the Natsu 2001 in a loss to Musoyama. At that point he was 13-1 while Musashimaru was trailing at 12-2. If Takanohana had ended up withdrawing on the last day, Musashimaru would have won the yusho by default. Because Takanohana decided to go for it and finish out the basho, he lost to Musashimaru in the first match but beat him in the playoff. However that ended up messing his knee so bad, which is what required him to have the surgery done. Like I said, had he not competed, he might have had a longer career than he did, and the knee might have healed properly.

http://sumodb.sumogames.de/Rikishi_basho.aspx?r=2&b=200105