Ichinojo intai

[Kishinoyama 582]

Maybe their is another reason for his retirement.

It is possible that Ichinojo checks out this forum and he really takes an interest in the GTB game. His expectations were heightened when he saw several players had him positioned in the M6-M7 area. When the banzuke was released on Monday his rank was much lower than predicted and that was the last straw. 

[ryafuji 807]

7 hours ago, Hankegami said:

I wonder whether a new scandal is going to come up soon and Ichinojo was strongly invited to retire. 

Has there been any indication in any other the reporting thus far that the decision wasn't entirely his own? Usually when the JSA issues these "advisements" we all hear about it straight away. 

[Eskbibs 72]

Huh? Huh???

Shock. There my man goes, just like that? I thought I was hallucinating when I saw the thread title...

[Hankegami 412]

1 hour ago, ryafuji said:

Has there been any indication in any other the reporting thus far that the decision wasn't entirely his own? Usually when the JSA issues these "advisements" we all hear about it straight away. 

Well, we hear about it immediately whenever a scandal has already broken out. Anyway, I could be just overthinking. As more detailed news came though, I saw that Ichinojo apparently decided to retire after his back pain came back despite his surgery. He had just enough of it. That can be the case. What still puzzles me is why he apparently didn't pre-plan his retirement at all. Well, perhaps people are right when they say that Ichinojo is no rocket scientist.

[Tigerboy1966 1,385]

Ichinojo is responsible for me being here. I had lost interest in sumo after it stopped being shown on Channel 4 in the UK but stumbled upon Jason's  youtube coverage of Aki 2014 and I was hooked all over again. He may be one of the best wrestlers of the modern era never to make ozeki: others had more tournaments at sekiwake or won more yusho but on the rare days when he was fighting at 100% Ichinojo did not look like an ozeki... he looked like a yokozuna.

[Jabbamaru 166]

Nooooooooooooooooo

[Naganoyama 5,856]

On 04/05/2023 at 07:11, Kaninoyama said:

Did he mention his post-sumo plans?

Rehab?

[Akinomaki 39,883]

It was a shock for the start of my journey to see the news of my favorite rikishi retired on my last look at the news before I packed my PC and headed for the airport. A bad omen as well, because when I arrived, my connection flight was canceled, giving me another shock in the morning - at least I made it by another route to the flight to Tokyo.

 

There may be no danpatsushiki, the oyakata said there are no plans yet for that, there was no handshake between the oyakata and Ichinojo, they left separately after the pres conference http://www.zakzak.co.jp/article/20230505-3TCR43KNW5PFLCPJ63HRUCQFQY/2/

more pics

o o o o o o o o o o o o o o o o o o

the career pics later

[Hankegami 412]

36 minutes ago, Akinomaki said:

There may be no danpatsushiki, the oyakata said there are no plans yet for that, there was no handshake between the oyakata and Ichinojo, they left separately after the pres conference http://www.zakzak.co.jp/article/20230505-3TCR43KNW5PFLCPJ63HRUCQFQY/2/

I don't like it - again. Sure, perhaps Minato just wanted to say that is it yet to be scheduled. But, considering that the relationships between the two is evidently at an all-time low, it can be easily understood in another way. Like, Minato does not want to have anything to do with Ichinojo from now on, including cutting his topknot.

I am unfortunately just not as knowledgeable in sumo as I'd like to be. How much common it is not to have a danpatsu-shiki - or anyway having one without your stablemaster? I know that Kotomitsuki and Sokokurai didn't have one when they were expelled, but it was because they hoped to be reintegrated one day - and Sokokurai did. Also, Kotomitsuki had his last cut made by Takanohana, but he held a private ceremony so he could do whatever he wanted. Aside from that, however, I understood that a danpatsu-shiki, even in a low-key manner (Chiyootori style), is always held. Both Asashoryu and Harumafuji, who were basically kicked out of sumo, had theirs. Sure, them both were very popular Yokozuna, so it was a great event anyway. Back to my main question, there is any precedent to not hold a danpatsu-shiki outside of very radical walkouts (e.g. 2011 betting scandal, the 1932 Shunjuen incident, etc)?

[Kaninoyama 1,694]

As for the danpatsushiki, the author of the article is just speculating that it's "even possible there might not be one," but all Minato Oyakata said was, "We haven't considered it yet."

Which given the suddenness of the turn of events, it not all that strange. So I wouldn't read too much into that. 

 

Edited May 6, 2023 by Kaninoyama

[robnplunder 974]

It is unsurprising given his chronic back issue, and recent trouble/suspension.  To me, he was so darn boring to watch and frustrating to follow.  I for one will not miss him.  I wish him luck though.

[Churaumi 728]

21 hours ago, Hankegami said:

How much common it is not to have a danpatsu-shiki - or anyway having one without your stablemaster? 

For sekitori that have the big danpatsushiki ceremonies outside their stable, it is usually set up by the wrestler. They have to rent a space, organize the event, etc. It would be very unusual to not include the stablemaster. I could see a wrestler like Ichinojo not wanting to go through the trouble of setting up an event like that, especially if he's not close with his stablemaster. I could see him just wanting to move on with life. Ichinojo never struck me as a particularly outgoing guy.

[Akinomaki 39,883]

13 hours ago, Kaninoyama said:

As for the danpatsushiki, the author of the article is just speculating that it's "even possible there might not be one," but all Minato Oyakata said was, "We haven't considered it yet."

Which given the suddenness of the turn of events, it not all that strange. So I wouldn't read too much into that.

I would, because the author is a bit above tabloid level and the way it is written implies quite some probability.

Hochi reports that apparently the 2 still only talk to each other by way of a lawyer - they didn't even look at each other at the press conference. o

Sanspo also assumes that there has to be some real reason behind it, apparently the shisho had tried to make him change his mind and also his parents wanted him to continue. https://www.nikkan-gendai.com/articles/view/sports/322537

Going to tabloid level, Nikkan Gendai points out that there was absolutely no reason to throw away at least  4.5 million yen of income, which he had received in 4 months kyujo as sekitori - even a kabu been decided and the later switch with Minato - to take over the heya. Nobody believes the story of the back pain as the reason, one oyakata believes he couldn't bear to have to face the oyakata any longer.  https://www.nikkan-gendai.com/articles/view/sports/322537

[Yarimotsu 530]

 For what it's worth, Chris' latest video takes a similar interpretation of reporters' remarks.

[Fashiritētā 169]

1 hour ago, Akinomaki said:

Going to tabloid level, Nikkan Gendai points out that there was absolutely no reason to throw away at least  4.5 million yen of income, which he had received in 4 months kyujo as sekitori - even a kabu been decided and the later switch with Minato - to take over the heya. Nobody believes the story of the back pain as the reason, one oyakata believes he couldn't bear to have to face the oyakata any longer.  https://www.nikkan-gendai.com/articles/view/sports/322537

Could Ichinojo change Heya’s?

 

[Gernobono 456]

2 minutes ago, Fashiritētā said:

Could Ichinojo change Heya’s?

 

no

[I am the Yokozuna 187]

@John Gunningso what is the word on the street? Why did Ichinojo leave?

[code_number3 694]

1 minute ago, I am the Yokozuna said:

@John Gunningso what is the word on the street? Why did Ichinojo leave?

ah, feeling this vibe...

Spoiler

"Here we go!"

 

[I am the Yokozuna 187]

Fabrizio is really a great source of information in regards to football related news and I feel he is being trusted to disperse it by a great deal of football clubs, players and agents. 

So, hopefully, we would have the sumo equivalent for that source of information. 

[Kaninoyama 1,694]

Hope all the juicy details of this story will emerge in due time, because so much of it still doesn't make sense.

Ichinojo seems to have been the one to have made a number of transgressions, but he's the one who can't stand to be around his shisho, rather than the other way around, so much so that he just tossed his sumo and secure post-sumo career away? 

And yet the shisho still wanted him to reconsider and remain in sumo to eventually take over the heya? 

Makes me think that despite his sumo success, Ichinojo is dealing with depression and never found happiness in his life in sumo and in Japan.

Hopefully he can find it in his life away from the sport. 

Edited May 8, 2023 by Kaninoyama

[Tsuchinoninjin 1,249]

15 hours ago, Kaninoyama said:

Hope all the juicy details of this story will emerge in due time, because so much of it still doesn't make sense.

Ichinojo seems to have been the one to have made a number of transgressions, but he's the one who can't stand to be around his shisho, rather than the other way around, so much so that he just tossed his sumo and secure post-sumo career away? 

And yet the shisho still wanted him to reconsider and remain in sumo to eventually take over the heya? 

Makes me think that despite his sumo success, Ichinojo is dealing with depression and never found happiness in his life in sumo and in Japan.

Hopefully he can find it in his life away from the sport. 

There is the rumor that the oyakata owed money to ichinojo, and if that’s true plus the fact that all other minato rikishi are sandanme or lower, ichinojo was a major source of funds for the heya. 
 

Now there is no sekitori in a small heya with a money problem, oyakata is in a tough spot.

 

I would probably avoid jumping to conclusions about ichinojo mental state just because he has a resting gloom face. It could be he just was feeling continually used for money by the oyakata.

 

Theres rumors on both sides, we can’t tell what’s going on. They may never come out 

Edited May 8, 2023 by Tsuchinoninjin

[themistyseas 226]

On 07/05/2023 at 09:57, I am the Yokozuna said:

Fabrizio is really a great source of information in regards to football related news and I feel he is being trusted to disperse it by a great deal of football clubs, players and agents. 

So, hopefully, we would have the sumo equivalent for that source of information. 

I think it would be quite difficult to get that for sumo, not least because of the privacy and secrecy involved - rikishi can't use social media anymore, anything that does go out is mostly kyokai vetted or approved, and as (as I understand it) the kyokai controls media accreditations, they may snap them back from people may be unreasonably critical. I have been by those in the media told that there have been times when media who used to have passes had to come and go then needed to retrieve them from Kokugikan on a daily basis so that they could be more closely managed, and we also know the kyokai has a track record of blackballing those who are seen as too much trouble. I don't know that anyone would rock the boat with any kind of unofficial exposé about rikishi when it could cut off their meal ticket to future access and content.

I'm not sure the stables have any reason in a world where rikishi don't transfer between heya to leak news, they don't gain anything by talking about injuries. Their main motivation (in the current system) for having a media contact would seem to be selling tickets to senshuraku parties or danpatsushiki, or koen-kai memberships/donations.

For what it's worth I totally agree it would be great to have. Funnily, a lot of hardcore fans on social media have started to call Fab a "tap in merchant" who aggregates rumours from elsewhere and applies a "here we go" when it's at the finish line. I think it's a bit harsh! But all of those parties have something to gain, whereas I think in sumo as currently composed it's a little unclear what anyone would have to gain by engaging with a 24/7 "hot stove" type of correspondent.

[Akinomaki 39,883]

Next the old angle, from tabloid Shukun Bunshun: the oyakata made him retire because he's a drunk. From a koenkai related source:

It started after the juryo yusho, Ichinojo invited friends and went on drinking tours with them, so heavy the neighbours complained to the NSK. The oyakata cautioned him and he cut off any communication, didn't appear for keiko any more since April. The oyakata had enough, Ichinojo broke his promise to stop drinking, he wanted him to retire, when he at last could contact him 2 days before the conference and urged him for a decision, Ichinojo at once said, "Then I quit." Minato had told the NSK "He doesn't listen to me, it's the limit." http://bunshun.jp/articles/-/62711

The opposite of what most other sources tell, the oyakata and the parents for one hour trying to convince the breadwinner of the heya to continue. It's basically the same story we had at the scandal and it turned out outdated and irrelevant. It may still be true and part of the story, but not the main reason.

[Kaninoyama 1,694]

12 hours ago, Akinomaki said:

Next the old angle, from tabloid Shukun Bunshun: the oyakata made him retire because he's a drunk. From a koenkai related source:

It started after the juryo yusho, Ichinojo invited friends and went on drinking tours with them, so heavy the neighbours complained to the NSK. The oyakata cautioned him and he cut off any communication, didn't appear for keiko any more since April. The oyakata had enough, Ichinojo broke his promise to stop drinking, he wanted him to retire, when he at last could contact him 2 days before the conference and urged him for a decision, Ichinojo at once said, "Then I quit." Minato had told the NSK "He doesn't listen to me, it's the limit." http://bunshun.jp/articles/-/62711

The opposite of what most other sources tell, the oyakata and the parents for one hour trying to convince the breadwinner of the heya to continue. It's basically the same story we had at the scandal and it turned out outdated and irrelevant. It may still be true and part of the story, but not the main reason.

If that was his behavior then he has no place in sumo or in Japan.

I can still remember a quote by Asashoryu regarding Ichinojo. "He's such a country bumpkin that I can't even have a conversation with him." 

Good riddance. 

 

[Gurowake 3,927]

1 hour ago, Kaninoyama said:

I can still remember a quote by Asashoryu regarding Ichinojo. "He's such a country bumpkin that I can't even have a conversation with him." 

I think a lot of people forget that part of the equation, that he comes from a nomadic tribe while all the other Mongolians have been city dwellers.  I've always thought that a lot of his problems have been adjusting to being in such a different world from when he was a child.

Edited May 10, 2023 by Gurowake