New Juryo for July

[Kintamayama 45,530]

First timers:

Kawazoe, now Kihou

Shishi the Ukranian

Yuuma

 

Returnees:

Shiden  (last time got promoted but never had a single bout-got a  reprimand from the Kyokai for going gambling and did not even gamble, but got suspended by his Oyakata, causing him to drop  back to Makushita..)

Chiyonoumi

 

 

Edited May 31, 2023 by Kintamayama

[Gurowake 4,107]

So Yuma is going to be like Meisei and keep using his given name?

[Koorifuu 1,020]

I guess the NSK is hoping Kiho is the new Enho. Straight swap...

[Bunbukuchagama 772]

Wait, they actually demoted Enho?

[Reonito 1,521]

6 minutes ago, Bunbukuchagama said:

Wait, they actually demoted Enho?

They don't announce the demotions, but he's the only possibility for a 5th exchange

[Bunbukuchagama 772]

Just now, Reonito said:

They don't announce the demotions, but he's the only possibility for a 5th exchange

It is fair, but I didn't expect it somehow. 

[Reonito 1,521]

yeah, I was on the fence, especially given that Yuma lost an "exchange bout" (also giving us a crystal-clear example of someone losing such a bout and still getting promoted, independent of any other results)

[Bunbukuchagama 772]

3 minutes ago, Reonito said:

yeah, I was on the fence, especially given that Yuma lost an "exchange bout" (also giving us a crystal-clear example of someone losing such a bout and still getting promoted, independent of any other results)

I am running with this case as a proof of "exchange bout" being a mythical concept invented by sumo fans. 

[Reonito 1,521]

5 minutes ago, Bunbukuchagama said:

I am running with this case as a proof of "exchange bout" being a mythical concept invented by sumo fans. 

I think they do schedule them with the intent that they make for clean exchange decisions, but it doesn't always work out that way. I am not sure what would have happened if Yuma beat Tsushimanada—would they have saved Enho? Promoted Tochimusashi?

[Bunbukuchagama 772]

Just now, Reonito said:

I think they do schedule them with the intent that they make for clean exchange decisions, but it doesn't always work out that way. I am not sure what would have happened if Yuma beat Tsushimanada—would they have saved Enho? Promoted Tochimusashi?

They definitely try to add some spice to late-basho bouts, but if they schedule a match between two 7-7 guys and one of them loses and gets demoted - did it happen because he lost that particular bout or just because his record ended up being 7-8?

Kyokai is such a secretive and old-fashioned organization that its decisions tend to be attributed to supposed subjective factors (like "rikishi A beat rikishi B therefore he has an advantage") that might not actually matter.

[Kyokufuji 64]

I hope Shiden makes Hidenoumi his tsukebito.

[Hoshotakamoto 259]

4 minutes ago, Kyokufuji said:

I hope Shiden makes Hidenoumi his tsukebito.

It just made me laugh to imagine Shiden rising to Makuuchi and letting all his frustration out in a bout vs Tobizaru.

[Seiyashi 4,108]

1 hour ago, Reonito said:

1 hour ago, Bunbukuchagama said:

I am running with this case as a proof of "exchange bout" being a mythical concept invented by sumo fans. 

I think they do schedule them with the intent that they make for clean exchange decisions, but it doesn't always work out that way. I am not sure what would have happened if Yuma beat Tsushimanada—would they have saved Enho? Promoted Tochimusashi?

Then Tsushimanada would have been demoted for Yūma, no?

[Reonito 1,521]

8 minutes ago, Seiyashi said:

Then Tsushimanada would have been demoted for Yūma, no?

Of course, but would that have saved Enho, or resulted in a 6th promotion?

[Seiyashi 4,108]

Just now, Reonito said:

Of course, but would that have saved Enho, or resulted in a 6th promotion?

I'm leaning towards save, considering the alternative is Ms4e 4-3 Tochimusashi (which is less compelling than Ms5e 5-2 IMO), but of course we'll never know.

[Seiyashi 4,108]

2 hours ago, Kintamayama said:

Kawazoe, now Kihou

Same first kanji as Kagayaki. Definitely not the same reason as Kagayaki, since he hails from Kumamoto-ken, Uto-shi.

Yet another Miyagino recruit in jūryō without a mage. We've seen plenty of those lately...

[Bunbukuchagama 772]

1 minute ago, Seiyashi said:

Yet another Miyagino recruit in jūryō without a mage. We've seen plenty of those lately...

I hope his foot holds... 

[Seiyashi 4,108]

Just now, Bunbukuchagama said:

I hope his foot holds... 

To be a bit more flippant, if he fights like that with a bum foot, imagine what happens when he's healed up.

[Seiyashi 4,108]

2 hours ago, Kyokufuji said:

I hope Shiden makes Hidenoumi his tsukebito.

Better still, I hope Hidenoumi is demoted instead of Enhō, forlorn hope though that may be.

[Ripe 73]

So let me see if I understand this correctly... previous basho they choose not to promote a 4-3 Ms3w for either 4-11 J9e or 5-10 J11e, but this basho they had no problem promoting 4-3 Ms3w (or 5-2 Ms5e) for 0-10-5 J3w?

Would it be considered a conspiracy theory if I notice that both in both of those cases guys who got raw deal are from Miyagino?

[Koorifuu 1,020]

7 minutes ago, Ripe said:

So let me see if I understand this correctly... previous basho they choose not to promote a 4-3 Ms3w for either 4-11 J9e or 5-10 J11e, but this basho they had no problem promoting 4-3 Ms3w (or 5-2 Ms5e) for 0-10-5 J3w?

Would it be considered a conspiracy theory if I notice that both in both of those cases guys who got raw deal are from Miyagino?

That falls in line with other bits and bobs here and there and is something to take seriously, but there's enough room and logic to believe this might just be a coincidence - neither situation was bewildering and falls within reasonable scope.

Now if they somehow find a way to keep Ochiai in juryo, particularly after all that "makuuchi shikona" fanfare, that'd be irrefutable.

[Jakusotsu 6,049]

30 minutes ago, Ripe said:

So let me see if I understand this correctly... previous basho they choose not to promote a 4-3 Ms3w for either 4-11 J9e or 5-10 J11e, but this basho they had no problem promoting 4-3 Ms3w (or 5-2 Ms5e) for 0-10-5 J3w?

If there was an infinite number of Juryo slots, both 4-11 J9e and 5-10 J11e would be ranked higher than 0-10-5 J3w.

[Gurowake 4,107]

59 minutes ago, Jakusotsu said:

If there was an infinite number of Juryo slots, both 4-11 J9e and 5-10 J11e would be ranked higher than 0-10-5 J3w.

Indeed, even if we were to use my general rule of thumb that an 0-15 is worth a -13 instead of -15, it works out to one slot worse, J16w instead of J16e.

[Katooshu 3,334]

There were posters predicting this ahead of time, as well as those not outright predicting it but considering it very feasible, just looking at the record + rank combo; it's an 0-15 thing, not a Miyagino thing.

Edited May 31, 2023 by Katooshu

[Reonito 1,521]

Last time was definitely eyebrow-raising, but the theories involved not wanting to promote Shiden from Ms6 (perhaps with his history factored in) and favoritism for Shimanoumi, with Kawazoe and Tsushimanada simply unlucky/lucky bystanders. This time is quite normal.