London koen- October 2025

[Tigerboy1966 1,417]

We are all going to be doing a lot of eye-rolling when the UK media covers sumo. "Rishiki" will be the least of our problems. But every sumo fan has to start somewhere: ten years ago I was regularly talking about "sanjaku" and "komosube"... and I thought that promotion and relegation worked like it does in football. Oh, and another one... for some reason I thought that wrestlers should be disqualified if their sagari fell off.

[Kajiyanosho 38]

14 minutes ago, Tigerboy1966 said:

We are all going to be doing a lot of eye-rolling when the UK media covers sumo. "Rishiki" will be the least of our problems. But every sumo fan has to start somewhere: ten years ago I was regularly talking about "sanjaku" and "komosube"... and I thought that promotion and relegation worked like it does in football. Oh, and another one... for some reason I thought that wrestlers should be disqualified if their sagari fell off.

There will be a lot of eye-rolling for sure. Possibly even more than that - have a look at how Channel 4 covered it today: https://www.channel4.com/news/sumo-returns-to-london-after-more-than-thirty-years

I'll try to get involved in the BBC online coverage next year (I'm the co-author of this article), to at least stir it away from factual mistakes and the usual clichés. But generally media coverage will be jokes about rikishi's diet and all that

[Tigerboy1966 1,417]

10 minutes ago, Kajiyanosho said:

I'll try to get involved in the BBC online coverage next year (I'm the co-author of this article), to at least stir it away from factual mistakes and the usual clichés.

Good to know that we have one of our boys (or girls) in there at the Beeb. Keep up the good work.

Edited December 4 by Tigerboy1966
clarity

[Kintamayama 44,660]

Google translate*, too tired for this today..

On the 4th, the Japan Sumo Association announced that it will hold a London koen from October 15th to 19th next year. This will be the first overseas koen since Las Vegas in 2005, and the second time in London since 1991. Chairman Hakkaku (former Yokozuna Hokutoumi) held a press conference at the same venue as the last one, the Royal Albert Hall, and said, "I hope everyone will enjoy the charm of sumo, which is an ancient traditional culture of Japan." The chairman, who won the 1991 concert as a Yokozuna, reminisced, "I was told that I would give a speech in English at the end, and it was a very tense five days." Juryo Kitanowaka (Hakkaku stable), who demonstrated his sumo squats and sliding steps to the press, said, "If I have the opportunity to participate next year, I will do my best to win." At the press conference, there was also a moment when the British media asked a question about the "no women allowed" rule. (Nice British press) The concert has attracted a lot of attention locally, and Chairman Hakkaku emphasized the significance of the concert, saying, "Nowadays, many foreigners come to Japan, not only to the main tournaments but also to the training halls. I think they are interested, so I would like to introduce Japanese traditional culture to them." The performance includes the dohoy-iri and the bouts of the top division wrestlers, and the winner will be etermined by the results over the five days. Overseas performances have been held a total of 13 times since 1965. Since 2006, there have been five overseas tours organized by promoters other than the association.

 

*Google translate is getting much better every day..

[Asashosakari 19,023]

3 hours ago, Kajiyanosho said:

There will be a lot of eye-rolling for sure. Possibly even more than that - have a look at how Channel 4 covered it today: https://www.channel4.com/news/sumo-returns-to-london-after-more-than-thirty-years

I'll try to get involved in the BBC online coverage next year (I'm the co-author of this article), to at least stir it away from factual mistakes and the usual clichés. But generally media coverage will be jokes about rikishi's diet and all that

I just have to ask: Were your colleagues previously aware that you're the resident go-to guy for sumo information?  Many thanks for putting in what's undoubtedly going to be hard work to keep the story straight over the next 10 months.

Edited December 5 by Asashosakari

[Asashosakari 19,023]

BTW, I wonder what that's going to do to next year's autumn tour back home. With travel days included, I guess we're looking at 9+ days break in the domestic jungyo schedule.

Incidentally, somebody pointed out elsewhere that the koen may coincide with one of the NFL's annual London games. I suppose hotels are going to be expensive no matter what, but if so that's probably not going to be great for availability/cost for Friday onward.

Edited December 5 by Asashosakari

[John Gunning 3,578]

The Royal Albert Hall are well aware that their claims that this (and 1991) are 'official' basho, and that they are the only two sumo events held outside Japan are incorrect.

I've told their staff and the people responsible for the event the same thing directly on numerous occasions. 

They simply do not care and are happy to continue perpetuating those (easily fact checkable) falsehoods, even including them in materials distributed to the media this week.

 

[John Gunning 3,578]

If anyone was at the 1991 London sumo event and is willing to talk about their recollections please give me a shout.

 

[Akinomaki 40,098]

ANN (Abema)

 

[Akinomaki 40,098]

NSK info https://sumo.or.jp/IrohaKyokaiInformation/detail?id=672

official page https://service.orikomi.co.jp/en/sumo-london

o

more from the papers

oo o

  o oo o o o o o o o

1991

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[Koorifuu 924]

3 hours ago, John Gunning said:

The Royal Albert Hall are well aware that their claims that this (and 1991) are 'official' basho, and that they are the only two sumo events held outside Japan are incorrect.

I've told their staff and the people responsible for the event the same thing directly on numerous occasions. 

They simply do not care and are happy to continue perpetuating those (easily fact checkable) falsehoods, even including them in materials distributed to the media this week.

 

This will all be my own speculative take, of course, but I wouldn't be surprised if the NSK is conniving with the organisers, particularly if their deal involves a fee for each ticket sold to a naïve foreigner and/or a share from publicity revenue.

They do this infrequently enough to keep the waters calm, any pressure resulting from the false claims will just fizzle out as soon as it came. And it definitely won't get to a level where finger pointing towards the organisers wouldn't work anymore.

Edited December 5 by Koorifuu

[John Gunning 3,578]

All JSA info related to the event treats it as a normal Koen.

The presenting it as a real basho comes entirely from the organiser and the RAH.

I’m pretty sure no one in the kyokai is reading English language media connected to the event, and even if they did I doubt they would care enough to start correcting their business partners in the venture over such phrasing as it has no effect on them or their core audience, nor is it ever picked up by media in Japan.

I don’t even know why it bugs me so much  - I’ve seen far more egregious claims made about sumo in the past by foreign media.

[Koorifuu 924]

 

19 minutes ago, John Gunning said:

I don’t even know why it bugs me so much  - I’ve seen far more egregious claims made about sumo in the past by foreign media.

I do.

Most egregious claims are borne out of benign ignorance, but there seems to be a swindling element to this one.

Edited December 5 by Koorifuu

[RabidJohn 1,725]

5 hours ago, John Gunning said:

The Royal Albert Hall are well aware that their claims that this (and 1991) are 'official' basho ... are incorrect.

We were misled about the London Basho 'counting' for banzuke purposes, for sure, but there was enough of a prize on the line for the rikishi to compete for real.

I've seen plenty of jungyo torikumi footage where it's clearly a show they're putting on: at the Albert Hall in 1991 they were hurting each other.

 

[Kajiyanosho 38]

1 hour ago, John Gunning said:

All JSA info related to the event treats it as a normal Koen.

The presenting it as a real basho comes entirely from the organiser and the RAH.

I’m pretty sure no one in the kyokai is reading English language media connected to the event, and even if they did I doubt they would care enough to start correcting their business partners in the venture over such phrasing as it has no effect on them or their core audience, nor is it ever picked up by media in Japan.

I don’t even know why it bugs me so much  - I’ve seen far more egregious claims made about sumo in the past by foreign media.

I've seen the invitation yesterday and it came from a PR agency working for the organisers Askonas Holt and / or the Royal Albert Hall. Several mistakes in just a few lines. The invitation said that the "tournamet (sic) will host the most accomplished and elite sumos (sic.), including those who have reached the top rank of Yokozuna". Sumos!

The invitation also indicated that both Kitanowaka and Fukutsuumi will take part in the tournament. If it will feature Makuuchi rikishi, Fukutsuumi definitely won't be there.

[Jakusotsu 5,876]

Try to imagine how difficult selling the event to the general public would be by getting all those facts right: "All the top ranked sumos will be coming, but they are actually called rikishi, and it's just for show and no real competition. The best of them all are called Yokozuna, but there's currently only one of them who will probably retire by October. And these two posing for pictures are real rikishi, but ranked too low to actually appear on stage."

[Naganoyama 5,881]

None of this sounds like swindling to me. It's much more like a combination of lack of knowledge/understanding and insufficient attention to detail.

 

[Morning 75]

Well, they could skip the "exotic" terms that are just there to look exotic to the lay people and just go with there'll be a tournament (which appears to be what'll happen albeit one that has no effect on the rankings) and the top ranked athletes/wrestlers are slated to compete, including the grand champion (chances are good there'll be a new grand champion by then).

[Yamanashi 3,779]

6 hours ago, Kajiyanosho said:

including those who have reached the top rank of Yokozuna"

Those Ozeki better get their butts in gear if we're going to have Yokuzunae for this "tournament".

 

14 hours ago, Asashosakari said:

the koen may coincide with one of the NFL's annual London games.

Combine them under the theme "A Weekend of Misunderstanding Foreign Sports."

[Koorifuu 924]

7 hours ago, Naganoyama said:

None of this sounds like swindling to me. It's much more like a combination of lack of knowledge/understanding and insufficient attention to detail.

 

DIfferent folks will have different opinions. But, in my book, getting money from people by deliberately misrepresenting the product you're selling them, amounts to swindling. I seriously don't believe that the organisers legitimately think their event is indeed going to be considered an official tournament.

I don't doubt they'll be selling plenty of tickets to people who don't want to miss this supposed once-in-a-lifetime event where London was graced with the privilege of being the only place outside of Japan to hold a competition, but would have little to no interest otherwise.

[Tigerboy1966 1,417]

17 hours ago, Asashosakari said:

I suppose hotels are going to be expensive no matter what, but if so that's probably not going to be great for availability/cost for Friday onward.

There are budget hotels in London  that will only set you back about £100 a night for a double room. We are looking at the Euston Station Travelodge which is a 30 min walk from the venue. Suits us as we will be coming down from Lancashire so Euston is our train station.

[Gurowake 4,021]

Is there anyone actually claiming that the tournament will have an effect on the rankings, or that it is equivalent to the 6-per-year tournaments in Japan?  There's plenty of wiggle room with what exactly "official" means.  It's being hosted directly by the Kyokai - seems official to me.  Is it a tournament?  Certainly.  Only if they are saying specifically the things mentioned in my first sentence is there any issue.

I'm not particularly familiar with truth in advertising laws in the UK, but generally in the US a degree of "puffery" is allowed - see just about every business who says they're the best in the area - as long as you don't say something that can't exactly be taken as an exaggeration, would have an effect on the choice of the targets, and is demonstrably wrong but not obviously so.

Edited December 5 by Gurowake

[Asashosakari 19,023]

31 minutes ago, Gurowake said:

Is there anyone actually claiming that the tournament will have an effect on the rankings, or that it is equivalent to the 6-per-year tournaments in Japan?  There's plenty of wiggle room with what exactly "official" means.  It's being hosted directly by the Kyokai - seems official to me.  Is it a tournament?  Certainly.  Only if they are saying specifically the things mentioned in my first sentence is there any issue.

I'm not particularly familiar with truth in advertising laws in the UK, but generally in the US a degree of "puffery" is allowed - see just about every business who says they're the best in the area - as long as you don't say something that can't exactly be taken as an exaggeration, would have an effect on the choice of the targets, and is demonstrably wrong but not obviously so.

This part of the BBC article at least strongly implied that the London event would be the same thing as the six honbasho by referring to both as capital-T "Tournament":

Quote

The event next October will be the first time in 20 years the Tournament has been held outside Japan.

There are six Tournaments each year held every two months so it took a while to be able to find a space in the Royal Albert Hall's diary which matched up with the rhythm of when the Tournament is held, according to the venue's chief executive, James Ainscough.

Whether the actual James Ainscough comment during the press conference made the same implication as this paraphrased version, who knows.

Edited December 5 by Asashosakari

[Gurowake 4,021]

1 hour ago, Asashosakari said:

Whether the actual James Ainscough comment during the press conference made the same implication as this paraphrased version, who knows

That's certainly very close to implying that it's one of the six major tournaments, yes.  It seems to do everything but outright state it, and you'd definitely have to know otherwise to think to the contrary.

[Asashosakari 19,023]

I suppose we need to cut the Royal Albert Hall people some slack... Even the Japanese embassy was pushing this bogus line, weeks ago. From Facebook:

Edited December 6 by Asashosakari