Training news updates

[Guest Kaikitsune]

Musashimaru did only light training until banzuke release day. Since then he has trained with sekitori. One report reported 20 bouts against Miyabiyama, Buyuzan and others winning all 20. He is also down to 233-234kg from his 237kg peak and looked strong during recent training session.

[Zentoryu 154]

Any news on how his neck is?

Judging by the training report, it doesn't appear to be bothering him too much.

[Guest Kaikitsune]

Any news on how his neck is?

Nothing was mentioned and since he does keiko I assume it isn't bothering him too much at least.

Juryo returnee Tomikaze (30) married his long time girlfriend (38, another example of rikishi marrying a woman older than him

[Guest Kaikitsune]

Dark clouds flow on "Chishiro Ocean's" clear late summer sky. Chiyotaikai was in the heat of training bout against Robocop on 29th of August when his left elbow deteriorated suddenly to cause pain censors alertly warning Taikai's brain. Taikai obeyed and went to hospital to have his elbow checked. Elbow overextends which implies to ligament injury. Soken is probably out of the question. Taikai takes it easy now. The severity of the injury isn't really spesified in this article?

http://www.sponichi.co.jp/others/kiji/2002/09/01/07.html

Overextension of elbow is quite harmful for pusher/thruster. Taikai often straightens his arms fully when attacking and handicap in that move handicaps his sumo too.

Splashing my spoon into the soup of Chiyotaikai's possible yokozunahood and his record as ozeki, I want to add that sometimes an illusion that an ozeki can't improve that much anymore comes into play and early ozeki-career problems are taken into calculation when determining his viableness as yokozuna. Chiyotaikai is much better now than two years ago. He has developed himself in every area of sumo. The negative part is that also in Natsu he was in great shape but still lost quite easily to Musoyama, Kaio and Tochiazuma in a row before manhandling Musashimaru on day 14. Against other ozeki and strong sanyaku, Taikai still is vulnerable when losing the tachi-ai. If yokozuna would lose three times in a row like Taikai did back in Natsu, he would be scolded badly and considered weak, no matter if his opponents were high quality. The difference to Musashimaru's case is that Maru is never weak when he is healthy. Neither is Takanohana.

[Kintamayama 45,093]

I have read this whole thread with great interest. I always read threads with great interest. Otherwise I wouldn't read them.

Everyone has a point somewhere that makes sense, but here are my two bits:

I've learned from life and conducting the Sumo polls, that we never know anything in advance. It's always not right to judge someone by his past- see Musa for example. I remember very distinctly how we ALL laughed Musa into oblivion. The poll "killed" him. And now he's OK..And he was an Oozeki for quite a long time, if I remember corrosively. And there's Chiyotenzan- he came up like a thunderbolt and was crowned the next Oozeki.

And there are many more examples, but it's too hot to remember.

My point is- there are guidelines implemented by Men in Black as to who is worthy of a promotion. These guys have proven along the years that they are usually right.(Who mentioned Miyabiyama??)Waka's promotion ultimately brought along his premature retirement, but we all sensed that he wanted to retire, that he was fed up. So some of us may have been right in saying he should never have been promoted, and some of us may think he would have retired regardless, since he would have been kadoban with those injuries, and who knows where he would have ended(who said Dejima??).

I say, all promotions are justified, since they are decided upon by a BODY of men who we can reasonably be sure have the good of Sumo in their minds. Sure, they make the occasional blunder, but percentage-wise, they are batting well over 70 percent. So if the little yellow-haired gangster will be promoted to Yokozuna on the merit of his last two basho's achievements, that's how it should be-promotion based on his ACHIEVEMENTS, regardless of the fact that he had a mediocre past as an Oozeki(a fact to which I too disagree completely..)

And if he doesn't cut it as a Yokozuna, he will be shown the door. If we try to implement some other way of calculating(like they did unjustly with Konishiki), we'd have one Yokozuna and two Oozekis. They may be ultimately strong, but we'd be definitely bored. Seeing an inept Oozeki crumble is sometimes as exciting as seeing  a great one.It's all part of the captivating world of Sumo..

[Hananotaka 8]

Sorry I haven't had the time to look into the forum for a while, but now I see some nice discussions going on.

[Hoshifransu 0]

Well, very brilliant analysis previously.

These guys have proven along the years that they are usually right

Absolutely right. Kyokai people know Sumo very very well and so, we can trust them. If they decide to promote (or not) Chiyotaikai, that's because they know he will confirm (or not) as Yokozuna. In the recent past, they didn't promote Kotomitsuki to Ozeki and the events proved they were right not to do it too early.

Even Miyabiyama's promotion to Ozeki was justified ... Two years ago, he was unstoppable, he was a big revealation ... Last night I was watching Kyushu 2000 and Miyabiyama had a 8-0 lead. He was a good Ozeki for a while ! I was a huge fan when he had this fantastic fighting spirit added to so many raw power, a couple of years ago. Today, I can't recognize the same Miyabiyama. OK, he had injury problems, but the spirit is not the same.

To talk about Chiyotaikai again, and the reason why we talk about him as very future possible Yokozuna next time, it's because he's strong favourite for Aki basho and I don't imagine another wrestler winning the Yusho. Maru's 4 defeats in a row last time at the end of the basho are a sign of his limits currently and I'm afraid to think about his retirement (as a huge fan) and Asashoryu's first Yusho could come but certainly too early for Aki too. Concerning Wakanosato, Takanohana, Tosanoumi, I don't think they have a realistic chance to win it too. Tochiazuma's presence is very doubtful and so with the other Ozeki recovering (and I don't imagine Musoyama winning a basho) "nothing's gonna stop him now" ! Who can stop Chiyo ? So, the problem to me, as a Sumo world fan, and I'm far to be a Sumo specialist, that's why my analysis is to be taken at a second level comparing to other fans in this forum who are really really great Sumo specialists, but it seems obvious, even for the simple fan like me that Chiyotaikai's Yokozuna promotion is a non-sense ! That would mean that Chiyotaikai is a level higher comparing to Kaio, Tochiazuma, Musoyama. I'm all right to say Musashimaru, Takanohana are a level higher on them, but not Chiyotaikai. If Chiyotaikai deserves to be Yokozuna, so do Kaio, Tochiazuma, Musoyama ... I don't imagine him a rank above the three others. He's not particularly better than the three Ozeki I quoted, and he's far to be superior to Tochiazuma, for example !

In fact, it's very severe, one more time, but all this makes me conclude that, despite his past injuries, Chiyotaikai is fit at the very right time !

A rikishi who goes 10-5, 12-3, 10-5, 10-5, 11-4, 11-4 would be promoted to Ozeki, while otherwise he would not be.

[Zentoryu 154]

In fact, it's very severe, one more time, but all this makes me conclude that, despite his past injuries, Chiyotaikai is fit at the very right time !

This whole argument could be pointless as Chiyotaikai's latest injury may prevent him from even contending for a Yusho.

However I still think its wrong to have called Chiyo a poor Ozeki and then say that Miyabiyama was a good Ozeki for a while.  :-)

There is no comparison!

Miya was one of the worst Ozeki (record wise) in the history of sumo.

Nagoya 2000   6-9

Aki 2000      8-7

Kyushu 2000   9-6

Hatsu 2001    8-7

Haru 2001     7-8

Natsu 2001    9-6

Nagoya 2001   7-8

Aki 2001      3-7-5

Four MK's and constantly on Kadoban status. Worst of all, during the course of his Ozeki career, he became progressively worse as a rikishi. In fact, it has been suggested that Miya's poor performance at that rank was one of the reasons that Kotomitsuki missed out on his own promotion earlier this year.

The Kyokai was afraid of making the same mistake with Kotomitsuki that they felt they had made with Miyabiyama, ie promoting him before he was ready, and they clearly felt Mickey wasn't ready.  

Again, I'd like to point out I'm not writing this because I'm a Chiyotaikai fan, even though it may seem like it at this point. ;-)

[Kaikitsune Makoto 209]

Last news before the basho:

Chiyotaikai's elbow is said to be 80% now which sounds good. Makushita bouts went fine in training.

Takanohana finished his preparation with 10 bouts against makushita guys.

Asashoryu suffers from slight fatigue due to herpes but is ready for honbasho.

Takamisakari is ready to go all out against Takanohana.

[Hananotaka 8]

Last news before the basho:

Asashoryu suffers from slight fatigue due to herpes but is ready for honbasho.

Are you serious?

(smacks forehead)

Well, I guess you really have to be careful who you get wet with your sweat...

[Kaikitsune Makoto 209]

Are you serious?

(smacks forehead)

Well, I guess you really have to be careful who you get wet with your sweat...

Herpes is also an innocent viral infection without any reference to the sexually transmitted herpes. Somehow herpes has a very dubious reputation without real reason for that. It is common and many people carry the virus all their life; some get the symptoms, some don't.

Here is the article covering Asashoryu:

http://www.yomiuri.co.jp/hochi/sports/sep/o20020906_10.htm

[Hananotaka 8]

Are you serious?

(smacks forehead)

Well, I guess you really have to be careful who you get wet with your sweat...

Herpes is also an innocent viral infection without any reference to the sexually transmitted herpes. Somehow herpes has a very dubious reputation without real reason for that. It is common and many people carry the virus all their life; some get the symptoms, some don't.

Here is the article covering Asashoryu:

http://www.yomiuri.co.jp/hochi/sports/sep/o20020906_10.htm

Ah, the article says it's oral herpes.

I did a little net-research, and now consider myself duly informed.

I apologize for jumping to uninformed conclusions...

[Hoshifransu 0]

However I still think its wrong to have called Chiyo a poor Ozeki and then say that Miyabiyama was a good Ozeki for a while.

[Tokimori 0]

Does anyone know of the training status now? Who are training and how hard? I'm quite new here, but does anyone know anything about Toki's training? Does he train at all or is it sheer talent? ;-)